Piha

[sevenrealm]

Just a few questions. I am new to the forum and am not sure if this topic has already been talked about. If there is information or a page that would answer all these questions then just let me know of where I can find it. I have questions about the PIHA and what it is all about.

1) Are the games played like a real schedule throughout weeks and weekends or are they done similar to the NCRHA where there are just tournements at central locations every so many weeks.

2) I know its PRO so thats where some of my questions come from...
--- do players pay to play ?
-----do players get paid to play?
Is it called PRO for the level or is it treated like PRO hockey, if you know what I mean. If players pay it seems like it would be a adult league with very high competition. Theres nothing wrong with this if thats the case I just wanted some clarification. Do games get a good amount of attendance ?

Im not knocking this league at all so dont take any of this as an attack as Im just getting info because I may play in it next season. Thank you for any help anyone can give.

[joisyan]

there are plenty of threads that will answer any questions you could possibly think of. just browse through the "professional inline hockey" category and you can find numerous threads about PIHA.

but as for the tournament style weekend, i know the AIHL does that on a number of occasions. i can't speak for the PIHA for this season, but last season it was only used in some playoffs as far as i know of, but not for regular season.

yes (most) players pay to play, some may get free rides, some may get paid. can't really answer that one either.

you will be getting your money's worth because it is a very competitive and fun league to play in. and the attendance varies on location.

[jamiyoder]

Thanks for your interest in the PIHA,
Our game set up is a scheduled season with weekend games. We play double headers on game nights to cut the travel down for the players and coaches. As for the very good question about "Pro". The PIHA has some of the best players in North America contributing to our league. We boast players such as CJ Yoder, Mike Cioli, Brian Yingling, Greg Thompson, and many other world caliber players. All players are given the opportunity to earn money for there teams with the availability of season tickets. This could help if not eliminate any cost to the player. But the biggest reason we are considered "Pro" is because of the end of the year money that every team is fighting for. Like NARCH or TOHRS Pro division we put up a purse for the teams to strive for. We feel having this purse helps bring out some of the best competition available. For the past 8 years PIHA has been dedicaded toward building the sport of inline and bringing a high level of competition to the players. Thanks again for your interest in the PIHA and if you are interested in being a part of any of our 18 organizations across the country you can check us out at Thepiha.com.
Jami Yoder PIHA Co-Founder

[SlammHockey]

I fully agree with Jami that the top players in the sport are currently participating in PIHA, NARCh and TORHs in their "Professional" divisions. You can not get better than the guys that he mentioned in the above posts.

What players in these league need to be made aware of is that once they participate in a sanctioned game at any of these events named above is that they lose their ability to participate in intercollegiate hockey in the United States. I am not sure if there has been a player that has been penalized by participating in an inline hockey event, but I can assure you that the NCAA does consider these items professional even if the players do not get paid.

Personally, I feel that these events should be listed as "Elite" in which the AIHL currently uses. You will find that the definition of Elite and the definition of Professional are entirely different.

Here is the language from the NCAA Constitution:

Article III, Section I "if [an] individual participates or has ever participated on a team known to the individual or which reasonably should have been known to the individual to be a professional team in that sport, the individual no longer shall be eligible for intercollegiate athletics in that sport."

The way that expansion is coming along in the NCRHA and the amount of member teams that are coming into play, I would not be surprised if they also initiated it into their By-Laws in the upcoming seasons.

This is just something that you want to make sure to ask questions about prior to stepping on the rink for all of these leagues, and additionally if you ever do feel that you might have an opportunity to play NCAA hockey, ask the specific inline hockey league officials to provide you with a letter or exemption from the NCAA.

[ianmackie]

Haha. Awesome response. That is why the college players don't play NARCh and TORHS...oh wait, they still do. Learn the actual rules and then try to understand them.

Third post huh...

If you would actually like some information on PIHA in St. Louis then just email me. [email protected]. I can help you out with your questions.

[hockey_rules]

I assume ianmackie is somehow affiliated with TORHS (since you have the link under you signature), if that's the case, you are not representing it very well by posting a condescending reply to someone who is just confused about the rules and not bashing or ridiculing TORHS. All the it seems he was attempting to do was give guys looking for NCAA ice hockey eligiliblity a heads up. Whether he was mistaken or not, he seems to have had good intentions.

Then you offer your help with info. Why would anyone ask for info from someone who has already responded to them in a patronizing manner?

I also don't understand how the fact that he's only submitted 3 posts is relevant to this post. The number of posts submitted is not directly proportionate to level of knowledge.

My point is just this, cut the guy some slack.

[-venom-]

I assume ianmackie is somehow affiliated with TORHS (since you have the link under you signature), if that's the case, you are not representing it very well by posting a condescending reply to someone who is just confused about the rules and not bashing or ridiculing TORHS. All the it seems he was attempting to do was give guys looking for NCAA ice hockey eligiliblity a heads up. Whether he was mistaken or not, he seems to have had good intentions.

Then you offer your help with info. Why would anyone ask for info from someone who has already responded to them in a patronizing manner?

I also don't understand how the fact that he's only submitted 3 posts is relevant to this post. The number of posts submitted is not directly proportionate to level of knowledge.

My point is just this, cut the guy some slack.

I agree.

Some people around here need to check their egos at the door.

[calihockey]

TORHS has been known to censor their own message board, yet a representative has no problem going on another message board and calling someone out? Even if he has little knowledge, why remove new people from the discussion? Maybe tactfully pointing out things that he may not be aware of would be far less offensive and far more beneficial. Keeping out people who are interested in the sport is detrimental to any continued growth. Not everyone is going to be all knowing about the sport. The only place where lack of posts comes into issue is when most of these posts are attacking in nature.

[iwearstripes]

I fully agree with Jami that the top players in the sport are currently participating in PIHA, NARCh and TORHs in their "Professional" divisions. You can not get better than the guys that he mentioned in the above posts.

What players in these league need to be made aware of is that once they participate in a sanctioned game at any of these events named above is that they lose their ability to participate in intercollegiate hockey in the United States. I am not sure if there has been a player that has been penalized by participating in an inline hockey event, but I can assure you that the NCAA does consider these items professional even if the players do not get paid.

Personally, I feel that these events should be listed as "Elite" in which the AIHL currently uses. You will find that the definition of Elite and the definition of Professional are entirely different.

Here is the language from the NCAA Constitution:

Article III, Section I "if [an] individual participates or has ever participated on a team known to the individual or which reasonably should have been known to the individual to be a professional team in that sport, the individual no longer shall be eligible for intercollegiate athletics in that sport."

The way that expansion is coming along in the NCRHA and the amount of member teams that are coming into play, I would not be surprised if they also initiated it into their By-Laws in the upcoming seasons.

This is just something that you want to make sure to ask questions about prior to stepping on the rink for all of these leagues, and additionally if you ever do feel that you might have an opportunity to play NCAA hockey, ask the specific inline hockey league officials to provide you with a letter or exemption from the NCAA.

College Roller Hockey is not governed by the NCAA. So that point is moot. Additionally, I'd venture that any player who is getting paid to play on a PIHA team is making so little money that it could easily be chalked up to expense reimbursements. There doesn't appear to be a section governing this in the NCRHA rulebook, though I presume they have some policy.

As its currently structured, I doubt NCRHA would disqualify a player for participating in PIHA, AIHL, NARCh Pro, or TORHS Pro, since the leagues all support each other one way or another, and are interested in growing the sport. There's just not enough money on the line for it to really be a concern. When guys are making $75k a year playing roller hockey, enough where its a full-time job, then maybe the college league will intercede, but at this point, the stakes are too low for it to matter.

Realistically, with what resources will the league investigate offenders? NCRHA basically operates on a shoestring budget, run by people so underpaid its basically volunteer work. If I was a college kid, or a university officer shelling out money to field a team, and found out the league was spending $3,000 to find out that a player should be disqualified because he made $5,000 a year playing in "pro" leagues, I'd be pissed. It'd be a poor use of the players', or the schools' money.

[Berry_Bramble]

This thread is one reason why I hate people and suck at life. Did anyone else see him post his email offering to answer any questions he has? Anyone?

[ianmackie]

Thanks Vio.

I have already received a few emails and actually helped them out.

Ian

[hockey_rules]

Giving an email address for further questions doesn't give someone the right to talk down to someone, nor does it justify such behavior. It's just about having common courtesy.

[Berry_Bramble]

he was only yokin

[SlammHockey]

I apologize for the confusion on the posts here.

What I was attempting to get through to everyone is that if a player has the intention of playing collegiate ice hockey or is currently playing collegiate ice hockey, they will find that there could be consequesces for participating in these "professional" leagues or events. Anytime that prize money is offered to a team or player they will put there amateur status in jeopardy, whether they get a piece of the prize money or not.

Here is a short part from the ruling (Karmanos vs. NCAA) that I had close to where I live:

The record reflected that, pursuant to Karmanos Jr's direction, Karmanos III had completed his final year of high school education in Canada during which time he had, pursuant to contract, played ice hockey with the Canadian Major Junior A hockey league. His contract contained a rider which provided that Karmanos III would not be compensated for his services and that Karmanos Jr. would pay all of his expenses. The contract also incorporated a "Certificate of Independent Advice" which disclosed that Charles J. Carson (Carson) of the Michigan Bar had advised Karmanos III of the implications of the contract whereupon Karmanos III "declared that he fully understood the nature and effect of said Standard Player's Contract."


After Karmanos III enrolled at U of M, Dr. Paul W. Gikas, the University's representative for intercollegiate athletics, initiated a hearing before the NCAA's eligibility committee where he argued that Karmanos III was not a professional hockey player because he had not been compensated for playing in the Canadian Major Junior A hockey league. The NCAA eligibility committee denied U of M's appeal on behalf of Karmanos III and declared him to be ineligible for participation in intercollegiate hockey. U of M informed Karmanos III that it would not contest the eligibility determination through litigation, but accorded Karmanos III the option of presenting his case to the NCAA's subcommittee on eligibility appeals. Thereafter, Karmanos III abandoned the NCAA eligibility appeal and initiated this action in federal district court which was subsequently dismissed by the trial court.

And as mentioned in my previous post:

Article III, Section I of the NCAA Constitution provides that "if [an] individual participates or has ever participated on a team known to the individual or which reasonably should have been known to the individual to be a professional team in that sport, the individual no longer shall be eligible for intercollegiate athletics in that sport."

THANKS FOR THE CLARIFICATION TUCoach!

The last retorical question is what if the NCAA sanctions inline hockey as an official sport, would players that participated in these events be considered professional and unable to play?

[TUcoach]

Not to add fuel to the fire, more something to chew on...from the NCRHA LOM...I don't believe players in PIHA, AIHL, Narch and Torhs would be effected by this rule because the NCRHA does not considered these true "paid to play" league.

C. General Player Eligibility
i. The NCRHA does not discriminate against gender and is an equal-opportunity organization that permits coed participation.
ii. : A student-athlete shall not be eligible for participation in the NCRHA if the individual received pay for participation in the sports of roller hockey or ice hockey. Student athletes who have played professionally, including Major Junior A hockey (OHL, WHL, QMJHL), shall not be eligibile for competition in the NCRHA.
a) In the context of this rule, pay shall be defined as receiving compensation (monetary or otherwise) in excess of the sum total of the cost of uniform, equipment and travel/practice/game expenses.
b) In the event of a challenge upon eligibility under this rule, players who have participated in professional or semi-professional roller hockey leagues must submit documentation indicating that pay was not received by said player.