XIHL and Super League

[extremes55]

XIHL just getting announced and now on MLRH website there is a supwer league...both getting started in fall of 2004

whats going on here? so much is getting thrown at us, but with just a little info.....im so confused

im done with roller hockey, im off to play badminton

[MDE3]

My point exactly

[BkHdTpShlf]

OK first off I'd like to give everyone out there alittle helpfull info. Don't listen to anything that JACKA$$ Bill Raue says. Sorry I'm putting it right out there but bottom line the MLRH would have belly flopped along time ago if not for Steve (and some of the top notch organizations). Just my opinion but I'll take my chances with Charlie,Benny and Steve.

Darrell Interbartolo

[NuHusky]

yo, you need any players for your badminton team? I am nasty i used to play in my backyard all the time. I beat all my relatives and friends at my summer bbq's.

[sactosaxons]

Amen!!!

[MDE3]

This is exactly what I am talking about...throwing the baby out with the bath water. The credibility problems the owners and founder of this new league may have with Bill Raue are an internal problem, to be dealt with effectively, but internally, not publicly.

The fundamental problem facing everyone in the Elite Inline "business' is that it has not yet found a way to generate money.....plain and simple. Hence Bill I am sure feels he is due some return on his time and investment over the years, and has probably caused some financial pain to those who believed in his vision and did not yet reap their rewards (team owners players etc.)

This is no doubt the fundamental root of the conflict. There is no return visible yet, so everyone wants to reinvent the wheel in hope that there is some new magic formula. The fact is that Professional Inline Hockey has to earn it's wings so to speak, and prove to the world that it is a valid form of entertainment, for which significant audiences will pay money to see! In order to accomplish this, the sport needs credibility..I think everyone so agrees. This credibility takes time, costs money, and takes perseverance.....like any other business venture.

Adding one or two more league corpses to the funeral pyre of failed elite/pro inline hockey leagues, does very little for the confidence of the fans in the viability of the sport. The fans who will pay for it's existance ultimately, and who must believe in it.

Last years version of the MLRH was much better than the year before in terms of stability, credibility, and quality of product (in MHO) although from a team owner's viewpoint probably no better in generating revenue. However the primary focus must be on the quality of the product...the quality of play must be exciting enough that people are happy to pay money to see it....that's the foundation plain and simple.

Only time and perseverance will prevail..there is no instant magic formula(short of my winning the lottery) that will waive away the ills. Only hard work and consistancy of growth.

The whole sport of inline hockey is so splintered, it boggles the mind of the uninitiated, and loses their interest rapidly...because it appears like total chaos so often. Although the intentions of AIHP may be well and truly good and stem from a desire to accomplish the things I mention here(including a unification), I seriously question the methods, and fear more harm than good will come. Do the same things but keep the names the same....close ranks for the good of the sport.

[NLane]

I think Mike said it best. The league (MLRH) was the best it's ever been last year and really due mostly to the Commish and the owners. They share the same thoughts for the forwarding of the league. These, I believe, have not included Europe. If you have been associated with MLRH since 1997 you would remember the Rolling Thunder pamphlet. Teams from the US would play then cross the ocean to play the UK. Bill has finally reached his dream. Not mine. I'd like to see a solid spread of teams from Coast to Coast in both checking and nonchecking form in a league, not just tournaments, with playoffs and a great Finals. We now have the management that can do it. These 3 names should bring in more credibility, sponsorship and, at the least, good will than ANY 1 name could or can. I will always think of Bill Raue as the creator of the MLRH and some of the finest games I've seen so far. But the future is bright and it will only get better and it is my intent to help it get there.

[sactosaxons]

Amen to the efforts of Charlie, Benny and Steve. I'd be hard-pressed to come up with three more qualified people to pull this off! And when expansion to the West coast happens, I'll be doing all I can to get a team in Sacramento.

[5_hole_master]

so mlrh is a seperate league from the XIHL?? according to the "super league" garbage posted it sounds like they are seperated, but then what teams are playing in it?

[clookNETAlec]

Yes,

XIHL is a brand new league that has nothing to do with MLRH anymore. Within the next 1-2 weeks I think they are going to release a full list of teams that will be playing this season :)

Congrads XIHL - I can't wait until the season starts!

[clookNETAlec]

I agree with your post, but then again none/most of us have no clue what happened with MLRH which has led to the formation of XIHL. Quite possibly the 'internal organs' weren't working but to everybody else it looked and functioned normally?

The XIHL will most likely be almost as good or better than the MLRH was this year - at least I hope so. Then, next year in 2005 when thje first official season is... it should be rockin!

Point being is that we should try and support the XIHL! I don't think Steve, Benny, and the crew would have formed a new league just for the fun of it - do you?

[NLane]

Your team was good 2 years ago. Can't wait to see them in the future.

[NLane]

In which it?

[coaching101]

Many of you are missing an element of the XIHL. MLRH is not the only player here. Its the MLRH and one other league (you figure it out) "merging" if you will and thus hopefully taking the strengths of both leagues and eliminating the weaknesses. Yes, Inline is trying to find a way to make money, but that can't happen as long as there are mutiple pro leagues competing with each other. Many of you forget where the NHL started and that it was still small potatoes as of 25 years ago. Before the merger/collapse of the WHL into the NHL the NHL was not nearly as visible or successful as it is now.

The money will come in time if the sport continues to consolidate. The trick is to build a league that attracts the top end guys from Tours and the other "paying tournaments", thus making the level of play. If thousands show up to the tournaments then its obvious that people are out there willing to pay to watch inline hockey. We just need to build a product as exciting as those tournaments.

Some of those playing in Pro Tours were in MLRH and PIHA, but not enough. Each year the talent level increases (as more of those players come to play in the pro leagues and the overall talent level rises) to the point that starters from 2 years ago, can only dream of making the teams now.

Have faith and patience, Rome was not built in a day. Those involved in the league will one day look back at this and all of the negativity from naysayers and bask in the spotlight and success of the league and hopefully the money.

[NoMoreNiceGuy]

Can you believe this, Benny has announced he was starting a new league, what 3 or 4 times in the past.

Steve caused most of MLRH problems in 2005 because of his friendship with some owners and his desire to remove certain teams from the league.

Charlie is a great guy but he can't get anyone to pay to see the games in his own league.

You don't announce a new league till you are ready to go!!
That means, teams and buildings signed.
Advertisers signed.
Schedule complete.

[NLane]

Gee, the NHL has all that....oh wait. They may not have players. HAHAHAHA. So much for that theory. And for all you posters who have recently changed your sign on's so no one will know who you are...chicken!!!!! It is really hard to start up a league (ask Jamie) by yourself. And the MLRH of 3 years ago had NONE of the things you listed 3 months before the start of the season. Nice opinions but no substance.

[SpiderRat]

Are you serious??? Unless you were playing in MLRH, you know nothing. Steve was the reason MLRH had a season last year. He was willing to work with the teams to make sure they got in. Extending deadlines if he had to. As a player, I respect Steve and consider him a friend. You know nothing of the problems Bill R. caused. Charlie is a well respected member of inline hockey. Enough said about him. As for Benny, I have never met the man but, from what he is saying, I'm willing to follow. What's wrong with what these guys are trying to do? The announcement was just that. An announcement that a new league is forming. Players like myself have faith in them and are willing to wait and see what happens. As for yourself, the opinion I'm getting is that you were either cut from a team during a tryout, not good enough to play, or have never played at this level and just won't or can't understand what is going on. Or maybe your Bill R. hiding behind a post. Whoever you are, your a coward. Your a coward because first, your afraid to sign your name, second, you fear change. I hope when all is announced, you will be the first a$$ to come on here and give props where props are due. Jerk.

Roger Lee

[dcdonkey]

SpiderRat,

To begin with, if it wasn't for Bill Raue, you're only option would be playing at rundown arenas in Cincinnati, Ohio at Narch Nationals or house league. He deserves more credit because it is obvious he is the creator of the first AAA league. Some decisions may or may not have been the greatest from a player or owner standpoint but at least he's working for roller hockey supremacy. Personally, I cannot understand why we are so quick to back another league when they have yet to release any details. What will this league do differently to put people in seats? Will they require real arenas (even if they're the size of WHL teams' arenas)? If not, how will we reach enough people to make a difference? Why won't they give us specific dates as to which they will release more information other than the vague, "next week"? Additionally, will there be a list of goals so we, the players and owners, have an idea of which direction this league is headed and what progress has been made? How will they be able to get the top players, if they're not willing to pay them? Sure, you can give all of a factory team's players new Tour pants, for example, but these types of players usually want to get paid as well. This is understandable because these players tend to play in leagues like the WCHL for example. Therefore, they require money not just for fun, but because hockey is their livelihood. Furthermore, the medical concerns of MLRH are still there. These issues include traumatic injuries that would keep fathers and potentially mothers, from earning for there families because of hospital time or even permanent injuries that would make these people unable to work again (i.e. brain trauma).

I'm not saying this because I am critical of this new league because I'm not. I am only an uniformed bystanding player waiting to see what direction the future of roller hockey is heading towards. MLRH is still the leading league in my mind. The XIHL has yet to inform me that this league is going to be different than any house league or tournament. I'm extremely happy that there are people out there making the effort for semi-professional hockey to succeed but I'm not sold that we have found the right business model to make it work. Perhaps to be successful we need to take a perspective much like the ECHL and WHA have taken to bring national and local attention. The biggest problem with roller hockey marketing so far, is that the public has no idea if this product even exists (but that is for another post). I respect you (and your goaltending ability) and all the people and organizations in the industry working hard to make leagues like these a success but I still have a lot of unanswered questions. Thank you for reading this post.

Sincerely,
Donkey

[NLane]

And what "uniform" are you wearing? These posts are not Bill bashing. Don't know a whole lot about his league for 2004 yet, now do we? If his league is the way to go then please feel free to play. Just click on the players association line on that website and send him your money. To keep the less informed player from doing just that I was hoping the XIHL would put out a message just to give the information that there is a choice of leagues. I still get joked by the local ECHL players about the MLRH season that was shut down 4 days before the 1st game was to be played. It did recover because of a lot of people's efforts including Bill's. He will always have the distinction of being the creator. If we want to see more info on the XIHL then patience, once again, is the word.

[dcdonkey]

I forgot to mention that we need a league to come along with what author and Stanford Professor Jim Collins refers to as a "Level 5 leader" in his book "Good To Great." As a reminder to those who are familiar with Collins, Tampa Bay Lightning Coach John Torterella had his team read this book and built around several of his concepts. Anyway, a "Level 5 leader" is a person who are a perfect mix of personal humility and professional will. Also, they are ambitious first to the company, not to themselves. These people are also rather modest and quiet. Furthermore, the people involved in this new league aren't the most important asset. Getting the RIGHT people are. Perhaps one of the biggest problems with roller hockey has been the fact that every organization thus far hasn't gotten the right people aboard. We as a semi-professional organization need to get the right people from President to player to water boy.

[yokes]

I 100% agree with Rog. Steve was the best move MLRH ever did. Charlie does nothing but try to forward our sport, plain and simple. Ive never met Bennie either but he is trying like the rest to do whats best for this sport and take it to that next level. Obviously with the announcement of a "superleague" it combats what these three are trying to accomplish and seems to be trying to take it down.

Goalies do it better with their eyes closed!!

[yokes]

Unfortunatly Bills name keeps the MLRH from becoming a league full of NARCH and/or TORHS players. If you talk to most he has done somethings in the past which have left a bad taste in alot of peoples mouth. These elite players will NOT come back as long ad his name is attached to it. I wont speak for Rog., BUT if my resume included that many NARCH and TORHS appearances and championships then i would have a credible leg to stand on.
As far as the XIHL, it will be better than MLRH because i imagine that most of the teams will be in that league and not in MLRH. Heres a question for you, you say MLRH is the leading league. Well you take the best part of MLRH witch is Steve, add a great hockey mind like Charlie Yoder, then add Beeny who has been trying to form a legit pro or AAA league on his own, and what do you have. I would say something more solid then concrete. This will basically start off where MLRH andPIHA leave off but it has a brighter future. These three are by far better than each as a individual working towards the same goal. I will agree and say that your post does raise some very valid questions though of a unestablished league.

Goalies do it better with their eyes closed!!<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by yokes on 08/08/04 09:10 PM.</EM></FONT></P>

[SpiderRat]

Excellent posts. Thanks for your input. I think the only reason I'm trying to stay optimistic about XIHL, is because again who the three men are. After spending time with Steve over breakfast one morning in New Jersey, I was completely sold on his ideas for the sport. He truly seems to have the players interest at heart. He had clear goals and ideas for the sport and appeared very excited about sharing some of them with me. You made several valid points, and believe me, I understand your concerns, but as a player of MLRH last year, I was very disappointed in the few dealings I had with Bill and truly think Ben, Steve and Charlie would not be setting themselves or us as players to fail. Here's one brief example of how I know Steve is serious about running a league. When I got traded to Ottakringer last year with 4 games remaining in the regular season, he gave me until midnight that night to get my player agreement faxed in or I would have to sit the remainder of the season out. After calling him and telling him that my home fax machine was out of ink, this being 10:00 that night, he said I needed to find another way of faxing it. So I drove like a mad man all over town looking for a store that could receive and send a fax. Finally I ended up at a friends bar, 5 minutes to 12. He sent the forms, I signed them, and proceeded to fax them back. By midnight, only one sheet was sent. Steve said I was unable to play. Suddenly the second sheet appeared on his fax machine. Everything was now cool. The point of my story was that even though Steve and I had become friends, a rule was a rule. And Steve was ready to stand by that rule know matter who it was. My level of respect for Steve increased 10 fold. The funny thing is, if I didn't make the deadline, and Steve said I couldn't play, I would have respected him even more for standing by his word to the league. I have no reason to think that Steve won't deliver the same degree of commitment this time around.

As far as getting NARCH and TORHS pro players involved, sure, I'd like to see more of them playing. The truth in the matter is that most of those guys play pro ice hockey during our season. Yet off the top of my head I can still think of a bunch of guys playing pro inline who played in MLRH last season, CJ, Darryl Interbartolo, Matty Denton, JD, Kenny Meyer, Paul Rogers, Jeff Goulet and a bunch more. We players who want to continue playing in a league such as PIHA, MLRH, XIHL, the Elite League in California need to embrace XIHL and hope for the best.

[dcdonkey]

Yokes,

I believe MLRH is the leading league because we are comparing a proven (meaning we can usually expect an MLRH season) league to a few ideas (though superb ideas) of three guys, that have been posted to a message board; therefore, making it really rather difficult to compare leagues. I can absolutely say that I enjoyed every minute of playing MLRH hockey (even losing). It is obvious that the XIHL has a solid group of leaders and one can only wish that the XIHL becomes the &quot;great&quot; roller hockey league that this sport has deserved for so long.

To answer an earlier post, I don't wear a particular league's uniform as of yet. Right now, the best way to describe my situation would be that I am stopped at a fork in the road waiting to find out which way to turn. Obviously steered toward MLRHville but I can always correct myself and change directions. Though, keep in mind, the car is slowly creeping forward as time progresses so a decision should be made before too late.

Furthermore, we cannot compare what happened in MLRH Pro to AAA because the schematics of a truly professional hockey league and a semi-professional hockey league are much different. Especially when we look at issues like salary, travel, and other countless issues. People don't realize how much money MLRH lost during it's 1997-98 season. When a league looks at further debt, sometimes it can become overwhelming as most league investors don't have the assets Bill Gates does.

[dcdonkey]

It appears that we, as players, owners, staff, and fans are in very good hands with the XIHL. Thank you very much for responding with your excellent post providing me a better grasp as to why we should embrace the XIHL a little more. I am not prepared to give up MLRH just yet but once I'm out of the dark as to league specifics, changes can be made.