2010-11 Divisional Changes?

[NUHockey72]

Looks this year's divisional application was intended to place teams in the appropriate divisions based on Section IV. B. ii/b of the League Operations Manual, due to the plethora of teams in Division II last year. Does anyone knows if there's been any responses or rejections to anyone's application yet?

I can't see many people being pleased with the league if we see West Chester Univ., Neumann Univ., SUNY Brockport, Missouri St., Grand Valley St. , UCSD and U of Tampa all return save for financial trouble. what teams "promotions" to DI would it take for you to believe that the enforcement of the LOM worked? Or what non-promotions would convince you it hasn't?

[GoRangrHky]

http://ecrha.net/standings.php?season_id=50094&regional_division_id=1

You tell me...

[NUHockey72]

I would say so. No Brockport or Temple in either division though?

[hockey1]

I would say so. No Brockport or Temple in either division though?

Temple will be playing D1.

[GoRangrHky]

Good for them. Every game they lost last year (save one against BU) was against one of the supposed "elite" 4 of the ECRHA. And they beat Neumann during the season. Here's to them being competitive next year and proving that middle of the pack teams can make the move.

[NUHockey72]

I think this might actually make for one of the most exciting seasons in the ECRHA in a long time, and quite possibly the entire nation if the rest of the NCRHA restructures their divisions along the same lines. To be honest regionals this year will most likely be a toss up since just about any of these teams in DII or DI can compete with each other.

[TUcoach]

I got word last night that Brockport will also be in DI this season.

[FWKRTJ]

Purdue, Grand Valley St. and Cincinnati all moved up to D1 in the MCRHL.

DePaul (moved up from D3), Schoolcraft (moved up from D3), Western Michigan (dropped from D1) and Wayne State (Expansion) all joined D2 for the MCRHL.

[catch]

From my perspective (Missouri State) I am not personally shocked nor opposed to moving up. However, we appealed the move to Division I for various reasons. If the placement in various divisions I am seeing on each leagues website is reflective of moving up or down, then we were moved up within days of our appeal, but never notified. That would be akin to finding out you were being found guilty before your trial, but you get the trial and the right to pay your lawyer anyway. I would hope this is not the case, if an appeal is this futile then just eliminate the process, "enforce" the rule and call yourselves a club sport dictatorship.

[FudgeMan]

Tell me how Tampa stayed down. They have matching equipment already. They have traveled to St. Louis the past two years before nationals. There is no excuse for this. If you force other teams to move to division 1 that requested division 2, then the standard should be nation wide. The league needs to set standards for each division and stick with them. The competition of all leagues will struggle because of these poor decisions. Also, don't go pinning down a team for these post. I am alumni now and what you did last year when I posted a comment about the scheduling was uncalled for.

[MBurke]

Tell me how Tampa stayed down. They have matching equipment already. They have traveled to St. Louis the past two years before nationals. There is no excuse for this. If you force other teams to move to division 1 that requested division 2, then the standard should be nation wide. The league needs to set standards for each division and stick with them. The competition of all leagues will struggle because of these poor decisions. Also, don't go pinning down a team for these post. I am alumni now and what you did last year when I posted a comment about the scheduling was uncalled for.

Not all of the regions have updated the divisions of their teams yet based on applications and appeals. Don't take what's on the website as final.

[hockeykid12]

so tampa will be moving up then?

[catch]

There is now a caveat on the Sotheastern league website which may imply appeals are pending. However, at least with respect to our team, we appear to be moved with no reply to our appeal, whereas the teams in the West appear to have remained in Division II. This is really a poor process, particularly to have votes cast as to where you play from people from other regions. People from different regions have no idea how their actions/votes are going to impact programs short or long term, they only envision what they think works best for nationals. Hockey can survive without nationals, it cannot survive without regions. Perhaps there should simply be separate regions and if people want to play a nationals at the end of the year a tournament can be put together. i don't see that the national conference has effectuated anything to improve our league or program

[hockeykid12]

tampa is a team that like others particularly in the east, should have their bid to remain in D2 be automatically denied which the east has basically done and said team a,b,c are going to D1 even with an appeal

[Chapwi]

There is no way tampa should stay down with the rest of the competitive D2 teams making the jump. And if the do try, they should be denied.

[FWKRTJ]

The MCRHL's divisions are set

[ECUHockey]

Just updated in the SECRHL. Tampa, Kennesaw, and GMU all moved up to DI. We are now considering the move as well.

[Missionhockey12]

Now that the news is out about us moving up to D1.. I have a lot of things bottled up and here are my 2 cents. I know people are on this board looking at comments. My intentions are not to bash the NCRHA but to give constructive criticism to make the league and their guidelines better.

So from what I understand this has been in the works since June (moving up teams like Tampa, KSU, Brockport GMU etc..) Why weren't we told about this possibly happening? Why did it take until NARCh for me to show a NCRHA head person my custom Tampa Gloves to say "now you reach the requirements for D1 and you'll probably be there this season."

Why does the NCRHA have piss poor guidelines? Is D1 based on money? matching equipment? Jason Walker from SUI-E had some of the most hideous equipment in the league and the kid could still play with the best of the best. Bottom line is the league should take care of this right after the past season and not 2 weeks before the season starts and say.. hey spend thousands of dollars on matching gloves helmets pants jerseys.

We almost ran into a big issue with losing players and we lost our goalie who was the backbone of our team. I think some of the decision for the D2 to D1 move should be prior success but what about retaining a 70-80% of your roster from last year. If teams lost their whole roster except 2 average players and the University some how fields a team and they get smoked their first year.. wouldn't that be discouraging?

This all could have been avoided if it had been taken care earlier. Why is the communication **sometimes** horrible. Why can't a national event be posted 3 months in advance when flights are cheap. I know the NCRHA puts time into picking the right facility and the cheapest bid.. and it seems they have started this process earlier this year and may have already found a place.. but why are things not taken care of sooner?

I hope people don't take this to heart. Like I said in no way am I bashing the NCRHA. I think the NCRHA has done an incredible job and has only improved. I've been in the league for 3 years this will be my 4th. I've seen how 3 regions function.. East, Southeast and Great Plains. All 3 are ran great.. the league is only getting better. But there are still issues that need to be taken care of or completely avoided.

Jeff Kotcher
University of Tampa #12

[GoRangrHky]

Who's buying flights three months in advance? Aside from Lindenwood, I don't think many others are.

Teams have made the transition to DI, struggled, and grew from it. They didn't get discouraged, they worked harder and made it better. They spend their whole summer working out and training, do off ice workouts, watch film, and learn from the best teams in the country that they are playing against. Then again, these are the teams that were willing to do it on their own and didn't have to get called out or forced to do it. I can't think of a single team that is moving up to DI this year that is going to have to shell out "thousands" of dollars on equipment. If you take 30 seconds to read what the requirements are, it's generally 2-3 guys that might need a helmet and a few that might need gloves. And what, your team has to have a perfect record every year? Nobody can be bad? It's not just about being good. It's about presenting the sport in the highest way possible. And it looks a hell of a lot better to have teams out there that look like college teams and not just a men's league on the rink.

If you want to get to work on the nationals bids, feel free to contact the NCRHA about what you can do to make it better. http://ncrha.org/staff.php There's a convenient link. Besides, last year nationals were announced on January 1st. http://ncrha.org/article.php?article_id=54065 That was 3 months and roughly 6 days before the event took place. Why do you need to know sooner? You booking your flight already?

[MasonHockey]

I hope ECU and Miami join us in moving up to D1, but I understand if you don't. I think you guys will romp in D2 though

[Missionhockey12]

How can you even say that teams don't shell out thousands of dollars on matching equipment? I know for a fact that we shelled out over a thousand dollars for a great pair of matching gloves. I know UCF last year got matching gloves and shelled out thousands of dollars.

We are from a small school. Around 6,000 students MAX. We are very fortunate to have the team and program we have. My brother and I have spread the word a significant amount and take a lot of pride in our program. If you look at our roster 100% of it is allllllllll east coast. When the team was started in 2006, I came down to a tournament in West Palm Beach to watch/coach and it was disgusting. It's exciting to see our program get better each year. From taking beatings in 2006.. making nationals in colorado (losing our equipment.. thanks American Airlines).. to nationals in feasterville making the elite 8 to nationals in san jose finishing top 4 and now moving up to Division 1 and other teams talking about it is an honor.

What team works out all summer and does off ice work outs and watches tape? We are college kids lets be realistic. Bottom line I think there should be guidelines for Division 1 and it should have a small percentage on matching equipment and money. I think previous success and a high percentage in retaining roster should be looked at.

In no way was I bashing the NCRHA. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. That's just mine. I'm very involved with the NCRHA and help run my regions tournaments when I can. Coming from the Island Wide League (IHSRH) on long island I couldn't imagine college without hockey.

good argument mike..

Jeff Kotcher
University of Tampa #12

[MBurke]

I think you're confusing me with AJ, Jeff. I haven't posted an opinion in here and will say only two things:

1. "NCRHA" didn't and doesn't decide anything on its own. The national organization is comprised of a skeleton staff of 3 people and every change in rules / policy is voted on by the NCRHA Board of Directors, which is comprised of one member from each NCRHA Member Organization. I will say that we had unanimous support for this at the meeting in June among the members present and that the primary considerations are ability to meet DI guidelines and organizational stability. There were hours of debate and concern over how this would affect clubs being forced to move, and the consensus was that regions would work to help teams succeed.

2. As for the gloves/helmets, I spent hours poring over pictures from DII nationals prior to the meeting. From what I saw there, no team NEEDS to spend thousands on those pieces of equipment, but there seems to be a lot of confusion among teams about the helmets and gloves needing to "match". This is not the case. The guidelines are here: http://ncrha.org/documents.php - they're the same as they were for DI last year. Helmets need only be the same color - model/make don't matter. Gloves don't even need to be the same color scheme! We're suggesting that players who have trim that doesn't conform to what's listed on the site do the same thing minor pros all over the world do - black out the offending areas with a paint marker. Using Tampa as an example - you can have most of your team with white gloves and black trim, one with red/white/black gloves, and another with black/white/gray and everybody's in compliance with the rule. All we're looking to do is eliminate the player with neon green / orange gloves from the equation.

As for nationals, we're really close to deciding on sites for not only 2011, but 2012 as well. This is something else we committed to doing at the meeting in June and we're in the process of reviewing bids with a vote on sites coming very soon (before the start of the season).

[Missionhockey12]

Mike,

I am very familiar with how the NCRHA has its members vote on certain situations like this. I think it's great and everyone gets their point of view across and their voice heard to persuade one another.

I appreciate you coming on the board and explaining everything. Very helpful. I actually thought AJ was Mike Scardino from Hofstra. AJ and I had a "chirping" incident in a house league game recently. Can you see the tension? lol

Bottom line I'm happy where we are and it will be a great season. We plan on coming up to Skate Safe for a regional in November.. we will see what happens.

Jeff Kotcher
University of Tampa #12

[ECUHockey]

I hope ECU and Miami join us in moving up to D1, but I understand if you don't. I think you guys will romp in D2 though

Mason, thanks for the compliment. We will not be moving up this year, as half of our team is new and we really need to play together before thinking of such a move. Next year will be our year. As for the "Romp" comment, I'm not sure if its accurate. Bethel seems to be a strong team in DII this year, and Im sure Florida Gulf Coast will be good as well. I see the DII league being competitive. We will be playing DI teams this year anyways, so we will see you all.

-Chris Crudele
Vice President- ECU Roller

[TourFLA98]

I dont know why people wouldnt buy tickets 3 months in advance... the NCRHA gives national bids to every D1 team out there

[NUHockey72]

How can you even say that teams don't shell out thousands of dollars on matching equipment? I know for a fact that we shelled out over a thousand dollars for a great pair of matching gloves. I know UCF last year got matching gloves and shelled out thousands of dollars.


Moving up to DII this year we made it a point that we should all have matching black helmets and black/red/white gloves this year just in case in the future we decide to go DI. We took a look at who had the equipment and literally 2 people had to buy helmets and new gloves. Typically you won't be shelling out thousands unless your buying goalie equipment or your team has an odd color scheme like a George Mason or Rhode Island.

[MasonHockey]

Thanks Chris,
I'm sure we will see you at most of the Northern SECRHL tournaments.
PS tell your brother Stephen we hope he comes to GMU. :)

[ECUHockey]

We will see you all for sure in Chantilly next semester.

I will tell him. he was excited about your prospect tryout. I don't know if I could play against him though ;)

[BEEZERAL]

Miami is staying DII for the time being. If we can survive a regime change at the end of the year and still remain organized/competitive, then there is no reason for us not to play DI next year

[GoRangrHky]

How can you even say that teams don't shell out thousands of dollars on matching equipment? I know for a fact that we shelled out over a thousand dollars for a great pair of matching gloves. I know UCF last year got matching gloves and shelled out thousands of dollars.

We are from a small school. Around 6,000 students MAX. We are very fortunate to have the team and program we have. My brother and I have spread the word a significant amount and take a lot of pride in our program. If you look at our roster 100% of it is allllllllll east coast. When the team was started in 2006, I came down to a tournament in West Palm Beach to watch/coach and it was disgusting. It's exciting to see our program get better each year. From taking beatings in 2006.. making nationals in colorado (losing our equipment.. thanks American Airlines).. to nationals in feasterville making the elite 8 to nationals in san jose finishing top 4 and now moving up to Division 1 and other teams talking about it is an honor.

What team works out all summer and does off ice work outs and watches tape? We are college kids lets be realistic. Bottom line I think there should be guidelines for Division 1 and it should have a small percentage on matching equipment and money. I think previous success and a high percentage in retaining roster should be looked at.

In no way was I bashing the NCRHA. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. That's just mine. I'm very involved with the NCRHA and help run my regions tournaments when I can. Coming from the Island Wide League (IHSRH) on long island I couldn't imagine college without hockey.

good argument mike..

Jeff Kotcher
University of Tampa #12

What's your point? You made it sound like the NCRHA forced you against your will to go to DI. Then you go out there and say what a fantastic job you've done of running your team and how you guys came up with THOUSANDS of dollars for gloves. And you then go on to talk about how good you guys were last season, making the final four or whatever you did (I really don't pay any attention to DII at nationals). I think instead of complaining about the NCRHA's "piss poor" guidelines and how they MADE you go to DI, you should just quit trying to sandbag it year after year and just move up on your own. What more should they ask for? You guys were good AND you have all the financials in place to get it done.

And like Mike said, nobody said you needed matching gloves. All they have to be is in your school colors. Plain black and white gloves are fine. And the helmets have to be the same color.

Again- not every single team in DI can be over .500. Somebody has to lose somewhere. So maybe you're not the best team out there season after season. That does NOT mean you should be playing in a division lower than what you deserve to be in.

[RowanPhil]

sweet new jerseys too

[PureHockey111]

What's your point? You made it sound like the NCRHA forced you against your will to go to DI. Then you go out there and say what a fantastic job you've done of running your team and how you guys came up with THOUSANDS of dollars for gloves. And you then go on to talk about how good you guys were last season, making the final four or whatever you did (I really don't pay any attention to DII at nationals). I think instead of complaining about the NCRHA's "piss poor" guidelines and how they MADE you go to DI, you should just quit trying to sandbag it year after year and just move up on your own. What more should they ask for? You guys were good AND you have all the financials in place to get it done.

And like Mike said, nobody said you needed matching gloves. All they have to be is in your school colors. Plain black and white gloves are fine. And the helmets have to be the same color.

Again- not every single team in DI can be over .500. Somebody has to lose somewhere. So maybe you're not the best team out there season after season. That does NOT mean you should be playing in a division lower than what you deserve to be in.

Im with Kotcher on this one too was not happy how the NCRHA went about the whole issue as well. simply the lack of communication and slow appeal process actually gave away one of our players to aihl. I know we had to spend maybe not a thousand but we had to buy all new gloves for the team. The appeal process also could not have come at a worse time with our local aihl tryouts, with the long appeal process we could not put a simple budget together and therefore lost a player out of frustration of OUR organization not being able to put together a budget because we couldnt finalize numbers due to no final answer from the ncrha. while the end result i actually liked: moving up better teams, better competition, and no more blowouts, however its just how the NCRHA went about the whole issue is what i didnt like. i mean at this point its over and there is no point worrying about it but in the future i hope the NCRHA can pull some info from their actions and in the future make the decisions earlier and handle the appeal process a little faster. again dont want to bag on the NCRHA, this is my second year and love every bit of it and what the NCRHA has done thus far.

Cameron Lensing
George Mason University

[Missionhockey12]

Cam,

Well said. Thats exactly how I feel. Certainly don't want to bag the NCRHA or throw them under the bus. Just think the process could have been taken care of in a smoother process. I too enjoy everything the NCRHA has to offer and they are only getting better. This is something to learn from and I'm sure they will build off of.

Bottom line everything worked out for the better and we had some great games in D1 this weekend in GA.

Jeff Kotcher
University of Tampa

[PureHockey111]

Yea hopefully next time we dont have to play two DII teams when driving all the way to snellville. disappointed in that. with wcu we just played our b team half the game so that was no fun for anyone. i would rather play all florida DI teams since thats basically the only time we get to see those guys until regionals. doubling up on either playing tampa twice or ucf twice is much better than a wcu.

[BEEZERAL]

Yea hopefully next time we dont have to play two DII teams when driving all the way to snellville. disappointed in that. with wcu we just played our b team half the game so that was no fun for anyone. i would rather play all florida DI teams since thats basically the only time we get to see those guys until regionals. doubling up on either playing tampa twice or ucf twice is much better than a wcu.

no disrespect to GMU but that scheduling decision made absolutely no sense. You should have played UT or UCF twice and maybe 1 DII game. There will be plenty of time for GMU to play against DII teams at regionals where only 1 other DI team attends

[MasonHockey]

no disrespect to GMU but that scheduling decision made absolutely no sense. You should have played UT or UCF twice and maybe 1 DII game. There will be plenty of time for GMU to play against DII teams at regionals where only 1 other DI team attends

Easy on the scheduling and WCU guys... it's not our fault or their fault they were on our schedule. We can only worry about what we can control. We will play D1 KSU and D1 NCSU in 2 weeks. At least our B guys were able to play in a competitive game after getting blown out twice by UCF B and KSU B.

videos of this weekend coming soon.

[BEEZERAL]

Easy on the scheduling and WCU guys... it's not our fault or their fault they were on our schedule. We can only worry about what we can control. We will play D1 KSU and D1 NCSU in 2 weeks. At least our B guys were able to play in a competitive game after getting blown out twice by UCF B and KSU B.

videos of this weekend coming soon.

you obviously had nothing to do with the schedule and play who is on it. but im sure you will agree that with as many DI teams there are this year no DI team should play more than 3-4 DII games all season

[D1hockey]

I definitely agree. as a d1 player we as in all d1 teams should not be playing many d2 games and it is unfair to the d2 teams that we do play because it will hurt there record. There arent that many d2 teams that could compete besides maybe MIAMI AND ECU. besides that it will just be a waste of team. i feel that each team should only play games in their division or 1 out

[PureHockey111]

yeah thats why it was frustrating when fau dropped out cause then we got scheduled against wcu. if it was up to me i would schedule us against all D1 teams and not even but us against a D2 game unless we would be tripling up on a team for games.

[MasonHockey]

you obviously had nothing to do with the schedule and play who is on it. but im sure you will agree that with as many DI teams there are this year no DI team should play more than 3-4 DII games all season


I definitely agree. as a d1 player we as in all d1 teams should not be playing many d2 games and it is unfair to the d2 teams that we do play because it will hurt there record. There arent that many d2 teams that could compete besides maybe MIAMI AND ECU. besides that it will just be a waste of team. i feel that each team should only play games in their division or 1 out

YES and YES!!! I'm kind of upset FAU dropped out because odds are we won't see them until regionals.

Just curious is anyone considering coming up to the INTER-REGIONAL at THE BOX on Feb 19th & 20th. KSU and us are already committed. If I can get one or two more D1 teams I am positive I could get some more teams like Rowan, Temple, Neumann, Brockport & other ECHRA teams to come down and play us. I'm hoping NC State will decide to come and maybe Tampa, FAU, UCF will join us. It is right near Dulles Airport, but I totally understand the distance issue.

[Missionhockey12]

We (Tampa) are actually going to NY-SkateSafe Regional as long as everything works out. I dont see why it wouldn't. We usually go to STL but because of Budget issues we are going to head to NY. If you look at our roster our whole team is basically from NY so hotels aren't an issue or rental cars. Makes everything easier.

Jeff Kotcher
University of Tampa #12

[MasonHockey]

That makes sense Jeff!
Good luck to you guys!
See you in Snellville!


We (Tampa) are actually going to NY-SkateSafe Regional as long as everything works out. I dont see why it wouldn't. We usually go to STL but because of Budget issues we are going to head to NY. If you look at our roster our whole team is basically from NY so hotels aren't an issue or rental cars. Makes everything easier.

Jeff Kotcher
University of Tampa #12