GPCIHL today.....

[JLambertUMSL]

- The biggest story was SLU's come-from-behind 7-5 victory over Truman State. Newcomer Shaun O'Rourke's third-period natural hat trick brought SLU back from a 5-4 deficit. O'Rourke had five goals and seven points while leading SLU to two wins Saturday. SLU is back. O'Rourke gives them a tremendous boost.

- Mizzou B tied Lindenwood Gold 2-2 this morning. That's a team who could win it all. Kevin McFarland is one of the best goalies in the GPCIHL, all divisions.

- St. Charles put a scare into UMSL this evening. UMSL had a 5-0 lead, but SCC scored four unanswered goals to make it 5-4 before UMSL pulled away to win 8-4. UMSL won both games today, and has one tomorrow (noon vs. Meramec...Illinois isn't going to stay for the 4:00 game). PJ Tallo had 9 points today, IIRC.

- Lindenwood mercied Illinois State in the season debut of Travis Fudge. LU has a light weekend -- their second and final game is tomorrow against UM-Rolla. Next weekend they'll play five games, including a cross-divisional clash with Truman State.

- Mizzou survived back-to-back games (4:00 vs. UM-Rolla and 5:00 vs. Meramec) to improve to 9-5-0. Their third and final game of the weekend is against St. Charles, who will be looking for revenge after losing 8-3 in the teams' previous matchup.

- With three wins, Missouri State (10-0-2) rolls along as the only undefeated team in GPCIHL DII. They play SLU on March 1.

Truman and MSU will get higher seeds, but SLU now has the best player in the league, plus the experience of last season's Nationals run. DII regionals could be very interesting.

[JLambertUMSL]

And Sunday....

Backstopped by freshman goaltender Steve Cash, UMSL B knocks off undefeated Lindenwood Gold 7-4. Alex Nebrig's third-period shorthanded goal was the biggest clutch play of the game. Nebrig is second in the nation in regular-season points, and first in assists.

Washington University topped SLU 4-2 to throw the GPCIHL DII race completely out of whack once again. It's amazing to think about how exciting and unpredictable GP DII regionals could be.

Lindenwood, in their final game of their first weekend with their entire DI squad on hand (Lindenwood opponents, beware the Fudge Factor), mercied UM-Rolla in 10:45. Rolla had just four skaters.

Mizzou and St. Charles tied 5-5. The third period of this game was as intense as any period I've seen played this season. Mizzou scored on the power play with less than a minute left to draw even. SCC's Gus Maloney had two goals and two assists, and now leads GPCIHL DI/III with 31 goals and 46 points. He is amazing.

The GPCIHL DII race took another unexpected twist this afternoon when Wash U tied Missouri State 5-5. Wash U captain Andrew Stern scored with :47 to play to tie the score. MSU is still undefeated and in first place, but Wash U has suddenly taken center stage with an impressive performance today.

[tsuG0alie]

Truman and MSU will get higher seeds, but SLU now has the best player in the league, plus the experience of last season's Nationals run. DII regionals could be very interesting.


I think the best players in the league are at the top of the leaderboard. I don't think you can call him the best after one weekend. Look at Dougherty, James. Hands-down best all-around player in the league, and that I've ever played with. Just because he doesn't put up 3 goals in a period doesn't take away from that.

Secondly, the last year's playoff run was also held together by the experience of one James Cash, who is no longer with them. I'd say (although it did hold down a struggling Truman team) the goaltending situation negates part of that experience you speak of. Not that they couldn't make it interesting, but I think the impact will be determined next weekend.

I wouldn't jump to conclusions after one weekend.

---------------------
John Pecher - #30
Truman State University
Club President

[catch]

well we finally have a scandal brewing in the great plains. I watched the Truman-St. Louis U. game. my understanding is truman played sick. when it was 4-4 truman missed an empty net. SLU barely eeked out a win on turnovers thereafter. SLU then lost to Wash U and barely beat Southeast. Washington U. played impressively this weekend. However, their tie with MSU came in a game where they possessed the puck rarely and converted a number of odd turnovers.

I note Mr. Pecher is not only the Truman State goalie, but also the team president. Please note MSU goalie, Cole Murphy, is not only the MSU goalie, but also a sanctioned ultimate fighter. I believe Mr. Murphy will decide who is the MVP and no one else will be allowed to vote. If there is any disagreement please see Mr. Murphy at the next game.

The step up of SLU and Wash U is great for the division. However, when it comes to nationals lets remember that SIU has put together a full season of work and deserves a lot more credit than a team who benefited from its ice hockey team quitting and joining the roller billikens. SLU did not follow up its work after they played Truman. Moreover, MSU remains undefeated. I note in the schedule SLU has ducked playing any division I opponents and I question comparing their record to the teams above them. For that matter, despite being a big bear (WashU is the baby bear) Truman plays Lindenwood and UMSL while we played Middle tennessee. I love the cross divisional play, but I question why UMR, Mizzou and Illinois did not partake. Is it once again that Mizzou will only play MSU in Columbia and only in football because of the fear of defeat.

[JLambertUMSL]

I think the best players in the league are at the top of the leaderboard. I don't think you can call him the best after one weekend. Look at Dougherty, James. Hands-down best all-around player in the league, and that I've ever played with. Just because he doesn't put up 3 goals in a period doesn't take away from that.

Secondly, the last year's playoff run was also held together by the experience of one James Cash, who is no longer with them. I'd say (although it did hold down a struggling Truman team) the goaltending situation negates part of that experience you speak of. Not that they couldn't make it interesting, but I think the impact will be determined next weekend.

I wouldn't jump to conclusions after one weekend.

---------------------
John Pecher - #30
Truman State University
Club President


I'm not looking at the stats at all. I know from seeing him play roughly 30 times in the past 12-15 months that O'Rourke is the best all-around player in GPCIHL DII. I said before the season, once I learned that he would be attending SLU, that if they could get him to play inline, he'd be the best player in Great Plains DII hands down. (And you are fully aware of how much I love JD's game.)

When Josh Matteo joined Wash U's team at semester break in '05-06, everyone knew he'd be one of the top players....and once Regionals rolled around, it didn't matter how many points Jake Shepard or Adam Clarke or James Wetton had...Josh Matteo was the skater who made the biggest difference. (Only Dave Garland was more clutch that day.)

O'Rourke is a dominant player. He's arguably the second-best '89 in Missouri behind Tallo. He was injured for much of last season, but saw some action in PIHA Pro once he got healthy, and more than held his own as an 18-year-old high school senior. He was also the best player on the Tier 1 state championship team at Lafayette.

Regarding SLU's championship experience, I'm talking about the fact that a lot of those guys saw it up close and lived through it -- not that they contributed to it (except for Kessler, who scored the goal that seemed to ignite the whole thing, in the first round against Emory at Omni, and was outstanding throughout the tournament). SLU always has a handful of extras on the bench who never play.....and the guys who sat and watched Nationals last year are now playing. They've seen it up close, have waited their turn, and won't freeze up when the time comes. Plus, in Dan Hurt they've got a head coach who in addition to leading his team to the finals last season, also guided them to an upset of an undefeated UMSL team at Regionals in '03-04, and a surprise national final-four appearance in '04-05.

(As I'm sure you know, it's nice having a head coach who's older and wiser than any of the players.)

Brendan Vail can stop the puck...that's a DeSmet boy we're talkin' about here. He stopped a barrage on Saturday in the third period that allowed his team to squeak past a quality opponent that was bringing everything it had. Kinda like the Truman-UMSL game last February, when one John Pecher put up a wall against an unbeaten team that suddenly realized it needed to get desperate.

(For the record, Pecher has been battling some kind of illness lately....I think that was a factor in Truman's loss on Saturday. From an UMSL perspective, one could argue that he's the best goalie we'll face this season other than maybe Lindenwood's Dustin Brown. The game this coming Saturday is going to be a LOT of fun!!)

[TSUMoody89]

when it was 4-4 truman missed an empty net.

Yeah. How pathetic was that? I think whoever that was should quit the game forever.

[JLambertUMSL]

well we finally have a scandal brewing in the great plains. I watched the Truman-St. Louis U. game. my understanding is truman played sick. when it was 4-4 truman missed an empty net. SLU barely eeked out a win on turnovers thereafter. SLU then lost to Wash U and barely beat Southeast. Washington U. played impressively this weekend. However, their tie with MSU came in a game where they possessed the puck rarely and converted a number of odd turnovers.

I note Mr. Pecher is not only the Truman State goalie, but also the team president. Please note MSU goalie, Cole Murphy, is not only the MSU goalie, but also a sanctioned ultimate fighter. I believe Mr. Murphy will decide who is the MVP and no one else will be allowed to vote. If there is any disagreement please see Mr. Murphy at the next game.

The step up of SLU and Wash U is great for the division. However, when it comes to nationals lets remember that SIU has put together a full season of work and deserves a lot more credit than a team who benefited from its ice hockey team quitting and joining the roller billikens. SLU did not follow up its work after they played Truman. Moreover, MSU remains undefeated. I note in the schedule SLU has ducked playing any division I opponents and I question comparing their record to the teams above them. For that matter, despite being a big bear (WashU is the baby bear) Truman plays Lindenwood and UMSL while we played Middle tennessee. I love the cross divisional play, but I question why UMR, Mizzou and Illinois did not partake. Is it once again that Mizzou will only play MSU in Columbia and only in football because of the fear of defeat.

I had an entire spreadsheet put together back in October with several schedule modifications that would have allowed for competitive cross-divisional games, and "showcase" afternoons with a four or five hour window featuring the best matchups of the weekend all in a row....it was just a suggestion, not really solicited, but nonetheless it got nixed.

Any cross-divisional play is tough to incorporate while maintaining competitive balance. I'm glad we got what we got, but I'd have liked to see MSU get in on it, and maybe match up against a team like UMSL, Mizzou, SCC, or Lindenwood to help prepare them for what they're going to see from Neumann (for example) at Nationals.

MSU plays Western Illinois three times in the second semester.

When you don't get pushed to the limit more than two or three times during the entire regular season, it is very difficult to perform under the pressure that a team like Neumann brings. We were completely clueless for the first period and a half against them in '06.

SLU-MSU on March 1....should be interesting!

[catch]

i couldn't agree with your analysis of the scheduling any more. you know the disdain between MSU and Mizzou is very deep. Mizzou refuses to play MSU in basketball. It was Mizzou curators who fought long and hard against MSU being called MSU. However, MSU has been playing and will continue to play division I schools under the cover of night at unknown locations. In fact MSU has played more than one game against a Division I school and has yet to suffer defeat. While this may be a deliberately misleading statement we are looking forward to a scrimmage with certain members of the Lindewood Lions in the forthcoming weeks leading to Nationals. At that point I antricipate recanting my statement regarding the undefeated record versus Division I. Between now and then I maintain MSU is the only other school undeafeted versus Division I competition in the great plains.

We will be looking forward to the game with the Billikens as well after not overlooking the Wash U. Bears this coming weekend.

[Ben Lambert]

I'm sure that if you guys want to come up for a Tuesday night game, we'd be all for it. Our practice is 8:30 to 9:30 at msg.

[train]

I'm sure that if you guys want to come up for a Tuesday night game, we'd be all for it. Our practice is 8:30 to 9:30 at msg.
i can't imagine anyone on the team wanting to play during the week.

[catch]

we would love to play you guys. wouldn't expect to continue our unbeaten streak against division I either. Appreciate the invite. However, the train is on track. it is a 3-3 1/2 one way trip. 44 is not the greatest highway, particularly at night filled with trucks. i use make that trip for blues playoff games once a series, back in the days when they made and lost playoff series. those were thursdays and saturday games. a tuesday night would leave us dead the rest of the week. maybe we can come up with a time between regionals and nationals.

[JLambertUMSL]

Washington U. played impressively this weekend. However, their tie with MSU came in a game where they possessed the puck rarely and converted a number of odd turnovers.

That's how Wash U wins. It's by design.

March 5, 2006...when they beat us 5-4 in OT in the league championship...they scored three goals off of horrendous turnovers leading to clean scoring chances. IIRC, we outshot them about 44-19, something ridiculous...

(That's right, OVERTIME...not shootouts...sudden-death overtime periods, like hockey is supposed to be. I am hoping that this year, the GPCIHL changes it back to the way it was in '05-06, when, at Regionals, we decided hockey games by playing hockey instead of having a damn skills competition.)

[JLambertUMSL]

we would love to play you guys. wouldn't expect to continue our unbeaten streak against division I either. Appreciate the invite. However, the train is on track. it is a 3-3 1/2 one way trip. 44 is not the greatest highway, particularly at night filled with trucks. i use make that trip for blues playoff games once a series, back in the days when they made and lost playoff series. those were thursdays and saturday games. a tuesday night would leave us dead the rest of the week. maybe we can come up with a time between regionals and nationals.

Fussner thinks it's hilarious that I keep bugging him to try to schedule us a matchup during a game weekend....but it's just not gonna happen.

Maybe we could play sometime during spring break. Refs, full uniforms, regulation everything...that would be fun.

[train]

Fussner thinks it's hilarious that I keep bugging him to try to schedule us a matchup during a game weekend....but it's just not gonna happen.

Maybe we could play sometime during spring break. Refs, full uniforms, regulation everything...that would be fun.
I'm not sure we need to have refs. We played UMR a while ago at All-American in a scrimmage. Nothing too official, but it was still a good game and fun.

[catch]

Train. Have you not surmised from my posts that I have deliberately left vacant who the other Division I team we defeated was. Now you have disclosed it its all over the forums. I already have 5 emails from UMR demanding that any forthcoming games we play be contducted strictly in Rolla and they will provide the refs. You have destroyed the home and home series. Train you are making this harder and harder. The only way to keep you on track is to again move up the time of departure Saturday. Again, Fritz will pick you up after work at midnight and this time we will depart at 2 a.m. All right, I'll admit it doesn't work it is only Tuesday and I'm in desperate need of sleep from last weekend. We'll leave a 5 p.m.

In all seriousness it would be a great experience for us to scrimmage or play UMSL before nationals or any time for that matter. You guys have a first class team and I respect the way you play and run your program. I meant nothing to lessen Wash U. either. They have a disciplined game plan and work hard.

[train]

Train. Have you not surmised from my posts that I have deliberately left vacant who the other Division I team we defeated was. Now you have disclosed it its all over the forums. I already have 5 emails from UMR demanding that any forthcoming games we play be contducted strictly in Rolla and they will provide the refs. You have destroyed the home and home series. Train you are making this harder and harder. The only way to keep you on track is to again move up the time of departure Saturday. Again, Fritz will pick you up after work at midnight and this time we will depart at 2 a.m. All right, I'll admit it doesn't work it is only Tuesday and I'm in desperate need of sleep from last weekend. We'll leave a 5 p.m.

In all seriousness it would be a great experience for us to scrimmage or play UMSL before nationals or any time for that matter. You guys have a first class team and I respect the way you play and run your program. I meant nothing to lessen Wash U. either. They have a disciplined game plan and work hard.
we can leave at whatever time you want on saturday, just don't get me drunk at buffalo wild wings again.

also, are you going to write the game summaries, or should i?

[catch]

it depends on 2 things:

1) do you think the school will be offended by or ever read the my comments?
2) Me getting a little time. With the practice being cancelled tonight I may be able to begin.

[train]

it depends on 2 things:

1) do you think the school will be offended by or ever read the my comments?
2) Me getting a little time. With the practice being cancelled tonight I may be able to begin.
well i was going to put them on the great plains website and ours, so i was hoping they could be serious. i know that isn't in your nature, but. . .

[catch]

well if the great plains is going to have access i wouldn't want to embarass ourselves being udfeated in in both division I and II. We must adhere to the standards of excellence set by our leader Cole Murphy

[csdahlberg]

...I love the cross divisional play, but I question why UMR, Mizzou and Illinois did not partake. Is it once again that Mizzou will only play MSU in Columbia and only in football because of the fear of defeat.

We (Mizzou roller hockey) aren't scared of playing anyone, but nobody has discussed any cross-divisional play with us. If anyone wants to play us, let me know. I'm sure our guys will be up for something, as long as it doesn't interfere with their drinking schedule too much. :rolleyes:



i couldn't agree with your analysis of the scheduling any more. you know the disdain between MSU and Mizzou is very deep. Mizzou refuses to play MSU in basketball. It was Mizzou curators who fought long and hard against MSU being called MSU.

I know I had nothing to do with creating/denying the scheduling of anything, and AFAIK there is no reason why we would refuse to play any other school.

[catch]

I don't personally believe anyone on Mizzou has tried to avoid playing us. It sucks that cross divisional play wasn't discussed with you guys. We played Middle Tennessee and nobody else. Truman played UMSL and Lindenwood. It seems like it would have made more sense for the teams in the middle like Mizzou, UMR and Illinois to play the top of Division II. Irrespective schedules are hard to work around. We have played UMR in a practice game and have one or two more set with them.

I only grief Mizzou because the basketball team has historically refused to play Missouri State and the curators and Mizzou and the Mizzou grads in the state senate had a fit about renaming Missouri State. People in Springfield complain frequently about these two issues with Mizzou and I was just touching on these points.

Seriously, if you guys would ever be interested in playing us we would be happy to set something up. The ride from Columbia to Springfield or vice versa is about 2 1/2 hours. The rink I recall in Columbia is pretty small. The rink in Springfield is large, but we have a wood floor and a concrete half wall. We met UMR at All American over Christmas break. If you guys make nationals and need a scrimmage perhaps we could work something out, drinking included to accomodate the drinking regimen for those over 21 of course.

[JLambertUMSL]

I don't personally believe anyone on Mizzou has tried to avoid playing us. It sucks that cross divisional play wasn't discussed with you guys. We played Middle Tennessee and nobody else. Truman played UMSL and Lindenwood. It seems like it would have made more sense for the teams in the middle like Mizzou, UMR and Illinois to play the top of Division II. Irrespective schedules are hard to work around. We have played UMR in a practice game and have one or two more set with them.

I only grief Mizzou because the basketball team has historically refused to play Missouri State and the curators and Mizzou and the Mizzou grads in the state senate had a fit about renaming Missouri State. People in Springfield complain frequently about these two issues with Mizzou and I was just touching on these points.

Seriously, if you guys would ever be interested in playing us we would be happy to set something up. The ride from Columbia to Springfield or vice versa is about 2 1/2 hours. The rink I recall in Columbia is pretty small. The rink in Springfield is large, but we have a wood floor and a concrete half wall. We met UMR at All American over Christmas break. If you guys make nationals and need a scrimmage perhaps we could work something out, drinking included to accomodate the drinking regimen for those over 21 of course.

Cross-divisional play wasn't really discussed with anyone in detail. Not that I know of, at least.

There was a master proposal....but I think it ended up just being too radical an idea -- too drastic a change.

In a college league, there's a four- or five-month regular season. These aren't tournament teams. The regular season isn't supposed to be a bunch of meaningless recreational scrimmages you play in to pass the time until the big tournament comes. Therefore, I submitted a proposal that I thought made the season more competitive and exciting. As it turns out, it's been fine as it is, but I'd have loved to see all the cross-divisional play that I'd proposed anyway.

Anyway, the season's almost over, and it's worked out fine. The thing we should be concerned about right now -- and it's driving me nuts -- is making sure the GPCIHL does not plan on deciding games at Regionals with shootouts like last year, especially as competitive as all the divisions could be.

This might be roller hockey, but it's also college sports. You don't decide a four-month season with a European skills competition. NO WAY. We haven't been practicing for seven months to have our season come down to penalty shots.

My team (UMSL B) has a chance to make Nationals with a good showing at Regionals. I put a lot of pressure on myself to give them the best chance to win, and later on it plays over and over again in my mind one way or the other.

I'll be honest. If I make a decision that costs us, it really bothers me. So the prospect of having to do something as random and meaningless and irrelevant as "pick my shooters," under pressure, with the entire season hanging in the balance, kinda makes my chest hurt. I'm too busy thinking about special teams, and shift length, and line combinations, and our breakout, and our forecheck, and matchups, and whether or not Chop is going to throw his stick and gloves on the bench when I replace him on the power play, and who's banged up, and who's tired, and who's most likely to lay it all on the line in the final minutes, to take the time to figure out who's my best bet to score on a penalty shot...and who's second-best, and third-best, etc.

(Not to mention the fact that we definitely don't have time to practice it, since our rink just completely pulled the rug out from under our entire organization by scheduling a high school team over us on one of our practice days, and a preseason high school tournament on two others, with no warning or explanation, giving us a grand total of one practice scheduled in the two weeks between the 5th weekend and Regionals weekend.)

Anyway, if it comes down to shootouts, I honestly might just flip a coin. Thank God I'm not in charge of our DI team too.

[William Bourque]

Feel bad for your teams that have to go through shootouts in the playoffs. The ECRHA plays sudden death overtime with 12 minutes periods.

Last year, Buffalo and Rhode Island played in a triple overtime thriller that was decided 12 seconds into the third overtime. The rinked was packed watching these two teams battle for every inch on the rink.

http://www.ncrha.org/game.php?game_id=69971

Additionally, Stony Brook and Neumann played to overtime in the regional championship game. The game was decided early into the overtime and the victory would have been cheapened if it was won in a shootout.

[JLambertUMSL]

Feel bad for your teams that have to go through shootouts in the playoffs. The ECRHA plays sudden death overtime with 12 minutes periods.

Last year, Buffalo and Rhode Island played in a triple overtime thriller that was decided 12 seconds into the third overtime. The rinked was packed watching these two teams battle for every inch on the rink.

http://www.ncrha.org/game.php?game_id=69971

Additionally, Stony Brook and Neumann played to overtime in the regional championship game. The game was decided early into the overtime and the victory would have been cheapened if it was won in a shootout.

We lost in sudden-death OT to Wash U in the regional championship game two years ago. A shootout loss would have been much tougher to swallow.

Last season was the first time we've used shootouts. Thankfully, the Missouri State-SLU game was decided by an OT goal (by Aaron "Dutch" Schulz), and didn't make it all the way through to shootouts. I saw a B game that did go to shootouts, without knowing that was the way games would be decided, and was horrified to say the least...it's hard to prepare for something when it blindsides you like that.

There are no shootouts at Nationals either. SLU-Neumann was sudden-death. I think there were a couple of overtime DI and DIII games too (Ohio State-Mizzou?).

[catch]

I have no qualms with how cross-divisionsal play worked out. It worked out fine. Everything needs to be refined a little. Maybe a cross game or two next year with say 3d in division one versus 1st in Div. II and so on down to the bottom.

Penalty shots are the most assinide way to determine the outcome of a game. I prefer sudden death or a tie. The NHL should get rid of penalty shots and the commissioner with them. Even worse is the absolute disgust in watching a world cup game come down to penalty kicks after waiting 4 years and sitting through 2-hours of play, just to see who messes up on hitting the corner on a ten yard shot.

[SnakeHandler]

i don't see how you can not like shootouts during the regular season... the nhl has it pretty much right. playoffs is a whole different story, but its fun during the season. we should have 3v3 for 5 minutes and then shootout!

[JLambertUMSL]

I have no qualms with how cross-divisionsal play worked out. It worked out fine. Everything needs to be refined a little. Maybe a cross game or two next year with say 3d in division one versus 1st in Div. II and so on down to the bottom.

Penalty shots are the most assinide way to determine the outcome of a game. I prefer sudden death or a tie. The NHL should get rid of penalty shots and the commissioner with them. Even worse is the absolute disgust in watching a world cup game come down to penalty kicks after waiting 4 years and sitting through 2-hours of play, just to see who messes up on hitting the corner on a ten yard shot.


Amen.

I'd have liked to see you guys play Mizzou. IMO, that would be a toss-up....one of the few games that truly could go either way, 50-50.

The "master proposal" I was talking about was a lot more than just cross-divisional stuff. It was admittedly way too radical to get everyone to buy in. Would have been exciting though.

[William Bourque]

The "master proposal" I was talking about was a lot more than just cross-divisional stuff. It was admittedly way too radical to get everyone to buy in. Would have been exciting though.

Care to explain it and possibly stir up some good conversation?

[catch]

Sankehandler. I hope the name is not reflective of your religious dedication, but if it is be careful when speaking in tongues. I would rather swim in a fish bowl with piranhas than watch a shootout. I had the pleasure of playing for a one time powerhouse in high school soccer in St. Louis. My claim to fame was that I was a second string player, but I never missed a penalty kick. 14 for 14. We played a state championship game in which I sat my arse on the bench for all but 10 minutes only to go to penalty kicks. With the score tied 4-4 on kicks and only my shot left I burried the ball in the back corner. It was no great feat. I could hit the back corner as often as I hit my mouth when I eat. Several years later my school made another championship game and again the game ended in a tie. The teams appropriately agreed to end the game that way. As for the NHL you know I have a hard time believing that guys who work one hour jobs would really be that exhausted if they played their games until they ended. Irrespective we are now at a point where we have a league with incredible parity. There are a multitude of teams within a few points. In the final analysis exactly what Lambert is stating about nationals being determined by penalty shots is going to send teams home or to the playoffs in the NHL.

As to cross divisional play radical ideas often times make things more fun. The Great Plains has a strange dichotomy as you have Lindenwood sitting there with a team full of scholarships, which is good on the one hand for the game, but anti-competitive. There are teams in the Great Plains Division I which I wonder what the hope to attain. Lindenwood would keep me from ever wanting to move up. If we moved up and took our lumps to UMSL so be it, we would at least start on the same level playing ground. Then we hit the bottom of Division II and the reality is while they are class people their is a big gap. I don't know that there is a realistic way to schedule it without jeopardizing a lot of standings for nationals. I would say a 2-game cross-divisional play would be good for everyone. However, there are thoase people who will always adhere to the notion that they would rather win 10-0 than risk losing 5-4.

[boring]

I have no qualms with how cross-divisionsal play worked out. It worked out fine. Everything needs to be refined a little. Maybe a cross game or two next year with say 3d in division one versus 1st in Div. II and so on down to the bottom.

Penalty shots are the most assinide way to determine the outcome of a game. I prefer sudden death or a tie. The NHL should get rid of penalty shots and the commissioner with them. Even worse is the absolute disgust in watching a world cup game come down to penalty kicks after waiting 4 years and sitting through 2-hours of play, just to see who messes up on hitting the corner on a ten yard shot.

who do you play for?

[catch]

I thought I made it clear. Western Kentucky.

[SnakeHandler]

As for the NHL you know I have a hard time believing that guys who work one hour jobs would really be that exhausted if they played their games until they ended.

i have no idea what the hell are u trying to say. nhl players only work an hour a day?

[DGlass]

3 periods @ 20 minutes per period = 1 hour.



Personally, I'm not a huge fan of shootouts, but I think I like ties even less. If nothing else, it adds the tiniest bit of strategy to the game (would an NHL team ever carry a 'bench' player who was lights out in a shootout but can't skate backwards to save his life...?) in terms of roster and order in which you send guys to take the shot.

At the very least, as a means of appeasing (and broadening) the fan base, I think the NHL should keep shootouts for regular season games. You really want to maintain the history of a game? Try eliminating the forward pass from football, or the three-pointer from basketball (DH from baseball? I agree).

The NHL is a business, after all, and is tied in last place with poker (a card game of strategy and luck) and bowling (the ultimate beer activity) for TV ratings. Sadly, I'm pretty sure poker gets higher ratings.

Thankfully, the NHL recognizes that its post-season is truly the most exciting to watch and its trophy is the most sought after (the only one where players touch it before owners, right?). The NHL will never do away with the sudden death, never-ending OTs of the playoffs. But the regular season? How many people will stay up until 3am to watch the Florida Panthers go into 5OTs against the Columbus Blue Jackets?


But I digress...I'm pretty sure they work more than 1 hour a day.

[JLambertUMSL]

Care to explain it and possibly stir up some good conversation?

Sure.

The biggest thing was that each weekend had a certain day on a certain rink that included a five- or six-hour window of nothing but the very best matchups -- a showcase type of thing. IIRC, the lineup of games on the final first-semester day was something like:

11:00 - Lindenwood vs. St. Charles
12:00 - UMSL vs. Meramec
1:00 - Lindenwood Gold vs. Lindenwood Black
2:00 - Truman State vs. Illinois
3:00 - Missouri State vs. Mizzou
4:00 - SLU vs. Wash U
5:00 - Lindenwood vs. UMSL
...roughly.

And instead of Western Illinois and Kansas State playing Truman State and Missouri State four or five times each, they were scheduled to play a couple of games against middle-tier B teams. Truman State and Missouri State had replacement games against Mizzou, St. Charles, UMSL, etc. And it all worked out.

Above all, it's about having fun, competitive games.

Of course, the issue (and I realize this) is that kind of schedule could make a difference between making Nationals and getting left out. And it probably won't be 100% balanced and equal (but the NFL, for example, gives a tougher schedule to teams that finished first the previous season, so it's not a completely foreign concept).

There must be something crappy about it.

[catch]

obviously they work more than an hour a day. it was a point of reference to the length of a game. You gentlemen are aware the NHL's excuse for not playing longer is physical exhaustation of the players and prohibition by the bargained for contract. The NHL has tried numerous gimmicks to lure new fans since the days of Peter the Puck. Instead they alienate their fan base. The new people who would be attracted to a shootout are the people with a very short attention span for the game. The NHL already lacks a captive audience because of lengthy breaks and a lack of interest from women and those over 40. Doesn't matter just merely statistical facts. Your point regarding the overtime of FLA and Columbus is a good one. It epitomizes why the NHL doesn't sell. If I live in Dallas I'm not watching Fla vs. Columbus, the Rangers vs. Tampa, etc. People only watch their own team. This is the identical dilemma baseball copes with. How many people watch the playoffs beyond the elimination of their team in the NHL. The shootout would necessitate fans channel surfing to just happen to land on the channel at the end of regulation with a desire to see a shootout for it to really matter. That doesn't happen so the NHL garners no additional viewers from the endeavour. Thus, the only advantage is leaving the fan at the game with the satisfaction of leaving without a tie. That is the real reason for the shootout. Of course so would unlimited sudden death. 4 vs. 4 resolves some of the length problem. This relates back to the point that the only reason we have shootouts is alleged player fatigue. Of course this is an NHL union deal. (I'm 100% in favor of unions just not for millionaires)

Gimmicks for a sport are a joke. Indoor soccer, Arena football, a 110 yard-wide field in Canada and yes the NHL. Back in the day of 21-24 teams it was a great sport. We now have constant mediocrity and semi-annual rule changes. Incidentally, some of those poker tournaments get pretty enticing when the Blue Jackets are the alternative. For my buck I take a night of TVG any day over an out of town hockey game.

Do not be offended snakehandler. Fred Phelps is watching.

[SnakeHandler]

Do not be offended snakehandler. Fred Phelps is watching.

wtf? fred phelps?

[train]

wtf? fred phelps?

fred phelps is seriously crazy.

[catch]

There is nothing crappy about the Lambert schedule. That is exactly what it is supposed to be all about. We all come to St. Louis 6 times a year and that it where it should live and die. Those 6 weeks are what the season is about, not the delusion that by sneaking into the nationals we are holding out hope to be champs. That philosphy is why we have 16 team playoffs. Your schedule is perfect. 1) it challenges everyone, which makes those who survive to Nationals better and prepared. 2) it motivates the teams at the bottom to keep playing because they have something more to drive 6 hours for than an arse kicking. 3) it show cases games. i have noticed that fans watch close games and only parents watch the mercy games. It is getting the people not obligated to watch interested that matters. Good competition breeds better competition.

[train]

Sure.

The biggest thing was that each weekend had a certain day on a certain rink that included a five- or six-hour window of nothing but the very best matchups -- a showcase type of thing. IIRC, the lineup of games on the final first-semester day was something like:

11:00 - Lindenwood vs. St. Charles
12:00 - UMSL vs. Meramec
1:00 - Lindenwood Gold vs. Lindenwood Black
2:00 - Truman State vs. Illinois
3:00 - Missouri State vs. Mizzou
4:00 - SLU vs. Wash U
5:00 - Lindenwood vs. UMSL
...roughly.

And instead of Western Illinois and Kansas State playing Truman State and Missouri State four or five times each, they were scheduled to play a couple of games against middle-tier B teams. Truman State and Missouri State had replacement games against Mizzou, St. Charles, UMSL, etc. And it all worked out.

Above all, it's about having fun, competitive games.

Of course, the issue (and I realize this) is that kind of schedule could make a difference between making Nationals and getting left out. And it probably won't be 100% balanced and equal (but the NFL, for example, gives a tougher schedule to teams that finished first the previous season, so it's not a completely foreign concept).

There must be something crappy about it.
i would much rather play a low-mid level D1 team instead of k-state or western illinois over and over again. nothing like playing a 15 minute game at 8 am.

[catch]

snakehandler. google fred phelps for the sake of it. I believe his church is called God Hates Fags. The reference means nothing demeaning to you. Snakehandling is a rather odd religion thus I have poked you a little about it. Fred Phelps takes that one step further, but he does look like a snakehandler. Anyway he isn't one to discuss on a hockey website. Just a bit of comic relief for life. Beware though before you consider transferring to K-State. He is close by

[boring]

I thought I made it clear. Western Kentucky.

wow i didnt know i was in the presence of the big red...so sorry

[JLambertUMSL]

Fred Phelps handles snakes every night and loves it.

[islanderfan]

I do like the look of a talent level balanced schedule. I also like to play top talented teams, as you can learn a lot from a 15 minute game early in the morning, as long as it's not every morning. I have always supported inter-divisional games. The main argument against them is our system for picking teams for nationals. Until more inter-regional games take place, there will always be great controversy over which region should have what bids to nationals. If we have inter-regional play, then we have a legitimate way to decide strength of region. It doesn't have to be only the top teams that travel to other regions, even the bottom teams can give you an idea of strength of the region. To that end, I'm hoping to have our team travel to Dallas one week-end next year and see how we do in that region. We also have a pre-season tournament we schedule in Denver. This one doesn't show too much because rosters are no where near settled, but it does provide a different style of play to learn from.
As far as Fred Phelps:eek: goes, he may be near us geographically, but philosophically, we are worlds apart on most issues and definitely on tactics.

[catch]

i in no way meant to associate fred phelps with k-state. fred probably hates the wildcats as well. what the heck he is probably the only kansas who questions the sexuality of Mark Mangino Tony Gonzalez. I wonder where Fred would stand on the slot machine issue for dog tracks in Kansas.

[JBeck10]

obviously they work more than an hour a day. it was a point of reference to the length of a game. You gentlemen are aware the NHL's excuse for not playing longer is physical exhaustation of the players and prohibition by the bargained for contract. The NHL has tried numerous gimmicks to lure new fans since the days of Peter the Puck. Instead they alienate their fan base. The new people who would be attracted to a shootout are the people with a very short attention span for the game. The NHL already lacks a captive audience because of lengthy breaks and a lack of interest from women and those over 40. Doesn't matter just merely statistical facts. Your point regarding the overtime of FLA and Columbus is a good one. It epitomizes why the NHL doesn't sell. If I live in Dallas I'm not watching Fla vs. Columbus, the Rangers vs. Tampa, etc. People only watch their own team. This is the identical dilemma baseball copes with. How many people watch the playoffs beyond the elimination of their team in the NHL. The shootout would necessitate fans channel surfing to just happen to land on the channel at the end of regulation with a desire to see a shootout for it to really matter. That doesn't happen so the NHL garners no additional viewers from the endeavour. Thus, the only advantage is leaving the fan at the game with the satisfaction of leaving without a tie. That is the real reason for the shootout. Of course so would unlimited sudden death. 4 vs. 4 resolves some of the length problem. This relates back to the point that the only reason we have shootouts is alleged player fatigue. Of course this is an NHL union deal. (I'm 100% in favor of unions just not for millionaires)

Gimmicks for a sport are a joke. Indoor soccer, Arena football, a 110 yard-wide field in Canada and yes the NHL. Back in the day of 21-24 teams it was a great sport. We now have constant mediocrity and semi-annual rule changes. Incidentally, some of those poker tournaments get pretty enticing when the Blue Jackets are the alternative. For my buck I take a night of TVG any day over an out of town hockey game.

Do not be offended snakehandler. Fred Phelps is watching.

I would differ with a lot of what's being said here. First of all as far as the shootout only being for people with a short attention span for the game, I don't feel that that's true at all. Back before the shootout was instituted during the regular season, a breakaway was one of the most exciting parts of the game. The shootout brings that same excitement to show case a players skill and moves. If a game is going to end in a tie, and that extra point is still out there, what's so wrong with awarding it to the team with the more skilled shooters/goaltenders. As long is it stays out of the playoffs when things REALLY matter, I see no problem with it. And when you speak of the long breaks in hockey, I really don't see how it differs from any other sport. Baseball and football have equally long breaks as well during the games.

What it really comes down to when you're talking about viewers and drawing in fans, is a love of the game. You talk about following the playoffs after your team has been eliminated, and I agree with baseball. When the Cardinals aren't involved I could care less. But I've watched every series I could during the NHL playoffs the past 2 years because I love the game so much. As much as I love to see the Blues in the playoffs, I watch the playoffs with or without them. It's some of the most intense and exciting hockey you'll ever watch.

As for the shootout being used in the NCRHA I agree with what James is saying. I was on the UMSL team when we lost to Wash. U that year and I would have much rather lost it in OT than in a shootout. The shootout has no place in the playoffs (which is where I feel soccer needs to make a change), but I honestly wouldn't mind seeing it during the regular season of NCRHA.

[catch]

beck- we just have very different opinions on shootouts.
one of the prime reasons networks don't carry hockey, particularly prime time is because of 2 periods. Football has the halftime highlights from the league and base 2 minute interludes. Hockey lacks the captive t.v. audience. In the past I have watched other teams throughout the playoffs as well, but as a whole american t.v. viewers do not, thus hockey gets covered on versus. Your points on shootouts are legitimate I just don't like watching games end like that. I love breakaways though.

[JBeck10]

Fair enough, You make a valid point regarding TV time. If the NHL isn't on ESPN so be it, they can keep their NBA games. As long as I can watch hockey in some way (Versus, FSN, or my new favorite, The NHL Network) I have no problem if it's not on the main stream scene.